SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Context: I'm M (30), my partner F (31), we've been together for almost 12 years and married for almost 3. About a year ago, things became quite monotonous, specifically in our intimacy. I love her, I provide, she's attentive to my needs, and many other things, but there's this detail: 2 months ago I met another woman, we started talking, and things escalated to infidelity (previously I had many opportunities with different people, but I never crossed the line into physical intimacy). We had two sexual encounters, we both enjoyed it, I felt desired as a man, I was able to be honest about everything sexual I wanted to try and AP reacted the same way, the adrenaline was something hadn't felt in years and we agreed to continue seeing each other, but the opportunity never arose. Throughout all of this I felt guilty, but the impulse won. AP contacted me from the beginning, and we presented everything as something casual, although there are two details in each encounter that left me thinking a lot. The first time, she told me she wanted me to do it without protection, which I completely refused, something that was spontaneous on her part. The second time, after we were intimate, she asked me a question: "Don't you think the guilt will be too great afterward?" which instantly made me feel bad.

Three weeks ago, it came to light, by my mistake cause i have plans of continue this affair and I had a discussion with my partner. We agreed to continue the relationship and improve things, which is happening, even sexually. I've felt things I haven't experienced in years with my partner. But even with everything improving and real changes in our intimacy, I can't stop thinking about having another sexual experience with this same person since i felt she left the door open because of our last conversation. I'm seeing a psychologist, trying to rationalize and be logical in my thoughts, and I'm trying to focus on my own things, my work, new activities, but the thought of writing to her again and having something physical again won't go away. It keeps coming back. I have it many times during the day with stronger impulses to contact her again.

What should I do? Should I give in to the impulse with the idea of "one last time"? I'm aware of all the personal and relationship consequences that doing it again would entail, and yet I can't get rid of the thought and the desire to do it.

Please help.

You should end the relationship with your wife because you seem far the suited to monogamny and don't appear capable at this time.

Your wife deserves better.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 7:20 PM, Thursday, April 23rd]

Hey again.

You might not want to get answers here in general just yet, as you are in the full high of the dopamine rush and affair.

You made this same post in the wayward side, and the answers you get there will be more "restrained " for respect of the suffering of the reformed wayward partners that are asking for help there.

Note the key

REFORMED wayward partners

You are not reformed you are at this moment a full blown unremorseful cheater who is asking for advice how to better betray his wife for a dopamine fix.

You are not suffering now, you are inflicting on your wife one of the worst abuse a human being can experience, and care zero for her pain.

You don’t realize now, you don’t care, not yet at least.

All that matters is the other woman, condom yes/no and the next validation dopamine hit before the next "one last time ".

The gentlest thing I can possibly say to you right now is read the REFORMED wayward partners pain and life destruction that infidelity caused them.

You may not give two fucks about your wife right this second, but surely you care about your self, and only about yourself. Truth is not even the other woman matters (as you don’t matter to her, she is just your mirror), all that matters is how fucking her (over your wife) makes you feel good about yourself.

I can only wish you that your conscience is biting strong enough to pull you off this self destructive path.

But your relationship with your wife is over, dead, not coming back.

Up to you how more you want to burn bridges or if you want to face your ghosts and understand why you are doing this to her and believe or not, yourself.

Because you also betrayed that version of you, and that’s not coming back ever either.

[This message edited by BackfromtheStorm at 7:42 PM, Thursday, April 23rd]

I'm aware of all the personal and relationship consequences that doing it again would entail,

No, you're not. You're completely clueless.

I want you to think about this. You came to group of people who are trying to survive infidelity, who are in a world of pain and heartbreak, and asked them if you "should" continue to cheat on your wife.

Do you have any idea how incredibly fucked-up that is?

Do you have any idea how incredibly fucked-up that is?

Like any cheater in the dopamine high of the affair he doesn’t have contact with reality at this moment.

Nor empathy for anyone or anything.

It’s fantasy time and can’t be stopped by rational thought or emotional intelligence because the conscience that he slammed in the cellar will immediately arise and he will have to face the horror of the evil shit he is pulling right now.

What he is thinking about in this moment is how to screw the AP without condom without risking an STD so he can fuck his wife later for all the time she is in hysterical bonding and not interrupting the carousel of pussy that gives him enough validation to almost feel like a man for once. And that might stop if the wife develops a bubonic rush gifted him by a skank.

Not that he cares about wife’s health in this moment, but if she gets some nasty STD she might be interrupting the hysterical bonding so impact his fun time and cutting it shorter.

He is feeling like James Bond sipping champagne and being the hero of an amazing movie story.

So whatever advice or response he gets from here, chances are in his mind this is going on "close minded morons they cannot understand that I am not a bad guy, that I am good, wife loving and caring husband, but I deserve this, you cannot get it, my situation is different and unique, I am not a dirty cheater, I am just a better man! I am the hero of my story"

You know about the circus clown drinking stale piss from a plastic cup analogy?

There, we are watching different movies.

He is proud of what he does, and he does not look for suggestions of how to recover the balls he lost to become the lowliest of the low.

He is looking for one thing and one thing only:

Validation.

After all everything that is and was going on was all about this in the first place.

@Op

How about you encourage your wife to get herself a stallion for some wild rides while you are visiting your affair partner for another couple of " one last time"?

Surely this will help you to feel a bit less guilty and you know you can talk about your sexual exploits with your APs and maybe your wife can learn something new with or without condom, and teach you so you can experiment with the other woman.

Sounds like a king’s plan right? You will both be so much happier and fulfilled, think about it: you will feel like a true man, your wife finally like a true woman! Having OW + your wife filled and fulfilled? Profit

The one deserved of this high lineage manliness

Note - if you feel the sting or feel my comments are being harsh, consider I equate what you are doing right now to the same abuses like rape and other sexual abuses, just knowing you will never be punished enough for it. So I am really restraining myself and trying to offer you some advice, but if even I can give you a sliver of chance as a person hoping you will come back to your senses, know I have nothing but contempt for your behaviors.

And believe it or not at the same time I am being your "best friend " by kicking your ass and telling you to grow a pair and stop fucking around.

I know you don’t understand it, but maybe in some time you’ll get it.

Good luck.

And please, divorce your wife and leave her alone ffs.

(To everyone else, WS, bs, men and women. The analogies are obviously my dark humor, I can be a real bastard but would never think that stuff seriously)

[This message edited by BackfromtheStorm at 9:08 PM, Thursday, April 23rd]

You sound like a real gentleman and great catch. Buy your wife a supply of tissues, sunglasses and ice cream. She will need it.

What should I do? Should I give in to the impulse with the idea of "one last time"?

What would you say to a heroin addict if they asked this same question? Because that's what's going on with you. You're not "in love" the way you think you are. You're addicted to the dopamine high you get from the excitement of betraying your poor wife.

You need to either man up and admit to your wife you're not cut out for monogamy, you're incapable of of being loyal to her, and get a divorce so you can sleep around with, and get your selfish affair high fix all you want, or you cut it off with your AP permanently, block her on everything, and never, EVER see or talk to her ever again. Period. Full stop.

Then begin the long and arduous task of doing anything and everything you possibly can to try and make it up to your wife, and good luck with that. I can tell just by the fact that you have to ask this question that you're far from a safe partner right now, and you're likely to just continue traumatizing her.

Infidelity is one of the most traumatizing, painful experiences a person can endure. You need to read up on it. Many describe it as worse than the death of a loved one, topped only by the loss of a child. PTSD symptoms are common and the typical recovery time from betrayal trauma is 2 to 5 years. Not weeks, not months. Years.

Read up on infidelity betrayal trauma and the "affair fog." Especially the latter. Because you my friend, are stuck in it so thick you can't see your own hand in front of your face. Of course it's going to be hard to see through the fog while your head is still up your... you know what I'm saying. If you love your wife you'll stop this abuse immediately. One way or the other. What you're contemplating is flat out cruelty.

My wife had a very short lived affair last year and it almost destroyed us. We're still reeling from the aftermath, and neither one of us are even close to being "over it." I read your post to her and she wants to come through the internet and slap you silly for even asking about this.

There's an entire page on reddit filled with non reformed cheaters who are looking for other cheaters to validate their disgusting behavior. If you're looking for validation for your actions, go post there.

Reading your story was difficult; I'm rooting for your wife, not you. If you are somewhat of a decent person, one day you'll wake up from this fog you're in and deeply regret it; until then maybe try therapy.

I read your post to her and she wants to come through the internet and slap you silly for even asking about this.

Ain’t it funny?
Same reaction from my wife and she is way fat from where reformed waywards are.

People who cheated seem to react with stronger disgust, I just find it weak and pathetic, only feeling bad for his wife.

Her reaction was gagging as to vomit. I doubt is the kind of validation he craves, but perhaps the day will come when he feels the same for the man in the mirror.

After spiraling a bit lower.

There's an entire page on reddit filled with non reformed cheaters who are looking for other cheaters to validate their disgusting behavior. If you're looking for validation for your actions, go post there.

There is where you will find what you are looking for OP.

There are pages of chats of cheaters explaining and enjoying the high of validation and the fun they are having while fucking around with kids and partners at home.

You will find wonderful things like

-How to lie to your kids, friends, family
-How to trick and manipulate both your wife and other women into thinking you are a good person so you can extract the most validation and sex from them
-How to deal when the AP drops you and keep validation going with the next AP or push a few more sexual encounters while searching for a new Affair Partner
- Ada between members to meet and start affairs on the understanding that they can keep providing validation to each other as the affairs have all an expiration date.
- hints on how to arrange encounters and best lies to tell your partner so you can feel like James Bond and not the circus clown (they don’t work, but who cares if you think they do, you’ll feel amazing, everyone is too stupid to see through your masterful lies)

That is the place you seek. You will find validation for your behavior, sexual partners to add to your rooster of wife / affair partner so you have rotation for when you will lose those women, you can tell all your excuses and find absolute understanding and validation as long as you validate their lies and excuses.

Enjoy the circus 🤡

Reading your story was difficult; I'm rooting for your wife, not you.

Aren’t we all?
I just hope she uses condom until the moment she drops out of hysterical bonding and divorces him.

She is still young and if she can heal enough she still can find a real man.
That’s what I wish her

OP here, I appreciate your contributions. I'm not looking for validation, approval, or permission to do or not do anything from anyone on an internet forum. I'm an adult and I know what I did, and I know that no one can fix what happened. From the moment I spoke with my W about what I did, I cut off all contact with AP and I'm being completely transparent about what I did, what I felt, what I think, and what I'm experiencing right now with W. There are no new adventures, no new encounters. She's the only person I've done anything like this with in my entire relationship. I have no intention of staying with AP or of her being my future partner. The physical attraction is what generated everything I described in terms of feelings and thoughts. So what I wrote is what I did with her, and right now I'm completely focused on improving for my W and the relationship, which is happening right now, believe it or not. Neither you nor I know for sure what will happen in the future; time will tell. The main idea and objective is... What I maintain is that my relationship continues, and I know I don't deserve W's forgiveness, but my idea is to live trying to win it back, even if it doesn't happen. I hope it does, and if this ends in divorce, it will be a consequence I'll have to accept and live with. As I said in the post, I'm in therapy with a real mental health professional, not random internet comments. I've already talked about many things and I understand what's happening to me on a hormonal, neurological, and behavioral level, and I'm still in this process. Even so, I'm still human and have this whirlwind of thoughts associated with everything I've already talked about. And you know, the reason I'm writing in a forum like this is to see my situation through the experiences of other people, where I know many cases are worse, repeated, with children involved, or illegitimate children born from the same situations (I don't have children). And I suppose that if many comments are made from a pedestal, it's because they're the best husbands/wives and have never made a mistake or had their partner fail them in any way. I'd be surprised if something like this existed in reality. I actually appreciate the comments that give me a broader perspective, where it's clear that people have gone through similar situations or received the necessary help with mental health or couples therapy. They give me some hope that things can improve with W. Those who want to talk trash are also welcome if it makes them feel better about themselves or their personal situations. To everyone else, I appreciate you reading and responding to my thoughts.

Again OP, I answered you elsewhere so refer to that and take this seriously in consideration:

You can find help here but you also need to be mindful and respectful of the other people’s pain.

This is the opposite of copy pasting the same posts in 2 completely different places without considering how this impact others.

This forum specifically is likely the worst possible place where you could post this way.

Do you know or even care what some people are living right this moment and the kind of life destroying hell that they have to endure for the behaviors you are being apologetic for?

If that thought even crossed your mind you would have least taken the time to write a more thoughtful response instead of copy pasting a passive aggressive minimization of your betrayal. You could have at least just cut that and only pasted the initial part where you clarified your position in a way better way than in your initial post.

While me and other people who are over this stuff might not budge at this lack of empathy, I guarantee you that the way you wrote things is really hurtful for the people who are in the thickest of suffering.

Easy to understand straight from the forum description.

Do the sensible thing, cut at least your defensive part and leave the explanations only.

Treat it as a first step to learn how to repair a flaw in understanding empathy, that’s for sure a valuable skill to learn if you are committed to rebuild a destroyed relationship with your wife.

And you will find out you get far less trash if you adjust your aim and attitude towards others. The kind of responses you got are not undeserved and you are being a quite unique case in this forum.

Some users messed up their opening, me included, but I still have never seen such a universally negative reaction from both BS and WS. Achievement unlocked I guess.

So you either messed up badly your opening or everyone is a baddie that just bullies you.

Accountability or projection?

Your pick.

[This message edited by BackfromtheStorm at 10:18 AM, Friday, April 24th]

And I suppose that if many comments are made from a pedestal, it's because they're the best husbands/wives and have never made a mistake or had their partner fail them in any way.

Nobody here is "on a pedestal." In fact most of us are in a pit and damaged almost beyond repair, and many have had their partner fail badly. No one is perfect or "the best" anything. Many of us have our flaws, but for most of us infidelity isn't one of them on the betrayed side. You don't need perfection to be loyal to your spouse.

Your post reads like a junky trying to convince themselves that they can handle "one last fix" and hide it from their loved one and friends.

You might think you know what you're flirting with, but you don't. There are plenty of reformed waywards here doing facepalms reading what you typed.

You wanted perspective? Well, you got it. From the other side. You came here and triggered a bunch of people who are still freshly wounded. Tho it seems to me preaching to us about how educated and self aware you are while asking the wounded if it's a good idea to throw another nuclear bomb on the rubble of your former relationship seems pretty counterintuitive to me...

You should read what BackFromTheStorm wrote. If you're curious why there's such universal negative reaction, they sum it up pretty nicely. The website is called "Surviving Infidelity" and you ask a bunch of people who wish they never knew what this website was "What should I do? Should I give in to the impulse with the idea of "one last time"? "

My life was turned upside down a few months ago and I was at absolute rock bottom. I stumbled across this site and read so many stories of people who were going through the exact same thing I was. This website was the only thing that made me feel not alone in some of the most horrible feelings a human can experience. So yeah, you asking me or others if you should give in to the impulse for "one last time" will result in me instantly despising you.

But I'll reply to your second message, because I don't actually think you're an asshole, I just think you're in some weird fog and have a horrible way with words.

From the moment I spoke with my W about what I did, I cut off all contact with AP and I'm being completely transparent about what I did, what I felt, what I think, and what I'm experiencing right now with W.

This is at least positive if you have been actually honest with your current feelings for the AP. While I don't think you're ready for reconciliation, this is at least a step in the right direction. Full honesty and transparency, no lies. Let her be the one that has all the facts and make the decision.

What I maintain is that my relationship continues, and I know I don't deserve W's forgiveness, but my idea is to live trying to win it back, even if it doesn't happen. I hope it does, and if this ends in divorce, it will be a consequence I'll have to accept and live with.

I agree, I don't think you deserve your wife's forgiveness. But if she's open to forgiving you and reconciliation is on the table, you better not take it for granted. It's easy to say that now when the wound is fresh; but will you still feel this way 1 year from now? 5 years? Don't put your wife through pain, reconcile and then wander back to your ways a few years from now. If you reconcile it's a long process, not just putting some bandaids on the wound and moving on.

And you know, the reason I'm writing in a forum like this is to see my situation through the experiences of other people, where I know many cases are worse, repeated, with children involved, or illegitimate children born from the same situations (I don't have children).

I would just completely avoid this sentence when talking to your wife. Having children vs no children doesn't make this situation any less harmful for your wife. Not having kids makes the divorce cleaner sure; but her wound is just as harmful as someone who has kids.

"Hey honey, we haven't had kids yet at least; right?"

I know that's not the intention of your words, but that's how it comes across. Especially to a betrayed spouse who's life was just turned upside down and they will be analyzing everything you say.

Your opening message left a really bad taste in people's mouths, but again I don't think you're an asshole. We're around the same age, I'm a few years older, but I think you have a lot of maturing to do. If you go the R route, please take it serious and know it's a marathon that will have good days and then bad ones. My heart breaks for your wife.

You are, unfortunately, wearing rose colored glasses towards the AP.

You see it as all rainbows and sunshine. The AP is "perfect". Can do no wrong. Your time together was amazing.

Welcome to Fantasy Island my friend.

Add in job stress and kids and finances and food shopping and laundry and illness etc. and then let’s see how "amazing" this relationship is.

Right now it’s an escape.

My H thought D me for the much younger OW would be a picnic. She’s soooo perfect! Here are some things he never considered:

Impact on kids
Loss of friends
Career impact
Finances managing two households

And that didn’t account for the D and loss of assets, college expenses looming in the future etc.

Just throwing in a reality check for you.

Add to what 1st wife said, your affair partner very likely, as it is for most, doesn’t care in the slightest about you.

You are her fix for validation and dopamine.

With you she can be a version of herself that doesn’t exist, and stealing the man from his wife is often the ultimate validation for many affair partners overall.

The moment you were to leave your wife she’ll drop you off faster than you can say "divorce".

Because you are a fix, not a partner, and if you are not feeling guilty for your wife and choosing her at the cost of your life and relationship, you are no longer a worthy dopamine fix for her low self worth.

You become baggage, annoying and inconvenient.

If the affair partner truly had feelings for you she would:
- not tolerate you sleeping and having sex with another woman (your wife)
- avoid to mingle in your relationship until you are a free man, able to engage with her (not having sex with you)
- crushed by the guilt you both are generating yourself, not being stimulated as she is by this very thing

Basically for her, any guy who is available to roll in the mud with her can replace you at anytime.
You are a placeholder, not chosen.
You were there and she sensed your morality matches her and you’d be down to engage in infidelity.

I know women enough to spot the type like a neon sign, you will see it soon enough

Experience here.

I can tell you without any doubt that you are living with a fantasy approach to the world. Your AP is just the current focus of the fantasy.

You admit that you have had "offers" before but didn’t follow through. That tells me that you have - at the very least - flirted with other women to the point they felt comfortable talking to you about possibly having sex with you.

That doesn’t happen in a vacuum. That happens as a result of your interactions, your indication of willingness, and their response to it.

This AP is no different, except for the fact you decided to drop any inhibitions and go for it.

The AP didn’t "make you feel" anything. She isn’t special. What you feel is the anticipation of having sex with someone who finds you attractive. Your wife found you attractive at some point, and you felt that anticipation for her at the beginning. But the fact is that the "new" wears off.

Think about it this way. There are people who are compulsive shoppers. They buy things for the excitement of the "new". They purchase something, get it home, and after one use they are beginning to look for something else to buy. God forbid that the new thing they just bought get scratched or dinged - because that makes it useless or worthless, because the "new" wore off.

So they shop for the next exciting thing that draws their eye. And it doesn’t matter the actual quality or usefulness or packaging, or much, really. It only matters that they get excited about it, that electric charge of fantasy-feeding.

They are filling a void.

So are you.

The AP isn’t different from any of the others you flirted with. Not at all. YOU are the common denominator in all of those instances. The only thing different about this one is the fact that you decided to betray yourself first and tell yourself that this was okay, you deserve the sex, you are special, besides that your wife isn’t everything she should be….you rationalized and justified and excused yourself to the point of being fine with betrayal.

You did that.

Your AP was just the current shiny object near you. She isn’t special.

You fantasize about a sexual world in which you are the epicenter.

Your fantasy allows the AP to be the most perfect partner ever. She has no flaws, because if she did the fantasy would explode.

I encourage you to read "Leadership and Self-deception: Getting out of the box" by The Arbinger Institute.

In that book, you will find the exact process by which you allowed yourself to go against what you yourself believe to be right and moral.

It is not a religious book. It isn’t a book about infidelity. It’s a book about your philosophy of egocentrism, and how to get out of that.

I know many cases are worse...

Do yourself a favor and disabuse yourself of this fallacy.

For most people, the betrayal of infidelity is a profound shock and a severe emotional and psychological trauma. It ALL hits harder than anything any of us have ever experienced in our lives. As far as I understand, from being here over a decade, the singular exception is the death of a child.

If you are truly committed to your wife and marriage, to reconciliation, then you've come to the right place. There is tremendous knowledge and wisdom to be found here, if you're open to the experience.

P27, I appreciate your honesty in presenting your perspective.

You wrote:

Neither you nor I know for sure what will happen in the future; time will tell.

I don’t know exactly what will happen with your marriage, but I know enough from past history to place my bet with winning odds.I bet you will be divorced in the near future. This, based on the data.

Question for you: do you think you are doing your wife a favor by not leaving the marriage?

[This message edited by HouseOfPlane at 9:12 PM, Friday, April 24th]